thegoheads - #
Hey jugglers!
Check out my recent adventure videos, with some of the finest southwestern US scenery :) and some juggling too!
Valley Of Fire
https://youtu.be/mRvamS46dgQ
Sedona
https://youtu.be/gBibVZPHKqA
Oak Creek Canyon
https://youtu.be/inPX_bdkD1Y
I have a lot of fun taking these trips and working on these videos. I hope you enjoy the music, scenery, and juggling! I will be uploading all these to JTV as well when I get more internet time...
-Steve
Robotic juggle - - Parent #
i didn't realize you were on this site. your "promo" video was magnificent to say the least
pumpkineater23 - - Parent #
Great juggling Steve.. as always. And stunningly beautiful backdrops, it must be an amazing part of the world for treks.
Roflcopter - #
How do you do it?
im not gonna try and correct my misspellings due to my shit keyboard so yoi may have to do a few double takes.
so I auditioned and made the cut for a talent show and have the act and song all together and even bought some knives for heending act. but lately i'm wondering "what was I thinking?" so I'm looking for help or just like what do those of you that perform do when preparing for a show?
When: all of a sudden tricksthat you can doand hve always done are extremely difficultand make you look dumb because you cant dothem to music or infront of someone?
theres no place to practice because there's horrid weather or slanted cielings.
when your out there busting your fingers apart and breaking your brand new stuff trying to snag the pesky part of the routine.
idk. tips on practicing a routine. have at it.
Roflcopter - - Parent #
helpful information:
I've been preparing for the act for half a month now.
there is no talking in my act.
itshowcases: 3-4 balls 3-4 rings 3 clubs 3 knives on rola bola
Owen Greenaway - - Parent #
I'm a keen juggler but I'm not a prolific performer. Anyway, here's my advice:
If you're performing to knowledgeable jugglers (maybe in a convention renegade/open show) then I feel you can get away with harder tricks as long as it looks like you are relaxed and it looks like you are having fun. They will be able to appreciate the tricks you are performing.
If you are performing to non-jugglers then I would focus on KISS - Keep It Simple, Stupid.
Remove all of the hard tricks. Remove all of the "pesky part". You know what you can achieve in practise and so your routine should be boring to you. The audience don't see you practise. They don't know these tricks are easy. They just enjoy your routine because you SELL the routine to them. Add expressions, mime and pauses to make the tricks look bigger, faster, harder and more impressive.
I think I've posted this on this site before but when performing to non-jugglers they will find it hard to tell tricks apart so make sure all your tricks are very different. E.g. do a high throw, followed by small tricks, followed by one body throw. Do things that the audience can immediately tell is a "trick" and immediately tell that it's difficult. You've seen each move a million times and so they are boring but your audience may have never seen the move before live and so will love it.
Use your current routine, with some harder tricks thrown in, to make an epic juggling video and then make a KISS routine for performing.
By keeping the routine really simple I believe you can focus on actually performing an entertaining routine instead of having to focus on the physical act of juggling.
thegoheads - - Parent #
I'm probably not qualified to answer this, but I will suggest that if you're entertaining a general audience (i.e. an audience of non-jugglers) the difficulty and even the amount of juggling doesn't matter nearly as much as character and stage presence. You can easily fill a few minutes of a routine with only a couple actual tricks, by adding a lot of fancy walking/dancing around inbetween tricks, picking up 1 ball at a time in creative ways rather than just running out on stage and blasting off right into a pattern. Audience engagement is important too. Be sure to smile and try to interact with the audience in some way, even if it's as simple as looking at them and smiling.
In other words, avoid just stringing together a bunch of juggling. In my experience 99% of people get bored of that in less than a minute.
I suspect you might not have been asking for advice on preparing a routine, moreso looking for advice about getting amped up to perform the routine you already have, but it's hard to tell with you sometimes :P Why not just proofread your posts and make one quick round of corrections? I find that beyond fixing typos, this will often help me gather my thoughts and express myself more clearly.
Anyway, the top paragraph is important because if stuff you used to be able to do easily is now very difficult, that stuff should NOT be in a routine. Audiences notice drops, but they don't notice when all you're doing is super-duper easy stuff and frolicking around. They leave saying "that guy was really good at juggling".
Roflcopter - - Parent #
it's a general audience, and I've tried to keep it simple.
I wanted to talk to the crowed and be engaging and sell it like you both have said. but after showing that to friends/family/crew they really just thought it was stupid. They insisted that I just let the juggling speak for itself. Actually how about I just post my routine?
I'm not a performer at all but I'm pretty sure that engaging with the audience doesn't have to include talking. By all means shows us your performance in a video so that we can give more specific critique.
Roflcopter - - Parent #
I will make a video and see how I can post it some where.
Robotic juggle - - Parent #
post it on juggling.tv i know your on their (hes a ginger)
p.s. im on there too but the videos are almost a year old and as ive only been juggling for a year and a half their baaaaddd
Roflcopter - - Parent #
Start:
my lovely assistant hands me three balls
3b behind back multiplex
right shower
left shower
columns
crossing columns
three in one hand
one up 360 x3 (this needs a little more work)
behind back x4
under leg x4
reverse mills mess
pause for applause
4 balls
async fountain to sync then back again
i throw one up high and then a three ball multiplex underneath that x3
4 ball shower (needs work)
pause
3 rings
colums
finger spins (maybe)
grind
grind under leg
they clap
4 rings
aync to sync and back
i take one ring and put it between my legs and switch back and forth like that.
all on the head (i can do it but not more than 5 times in a row)
applause
3 clubs
multiplex
doubles
circus doubles into
flats
columns
column variation
chops
behind back
under leg
club balance
reverse mills
scissor catch
bring out the knives
cut a potato in half
step up on the rola bola
juggle and make judges piss themselves
thegoheads - - Parent #
Hey that seems pretty good! If your friends/family think you need to put in more difficult tricks to better impress the judges, it's your call if you want to do that. But I think the judges will be better impressed by attitude and stage presence. Keeping it simple avoids drops though.
Good luck, let us know how it turns out :)
Robotic juggle - - Parent #
in my experience with crowds (especially with talent shows) no one in the crowd, bar a few, really know what their looking at and some tricks that you find to be arbitrary boggle their minds. im preparing for a talent show as well and i could pull out 5 balls and do the hardest tricks in my repituior (excuse my poor french spelling) i find that if i stick with three balls, and do mills mess and a 720 or something most people will be very impressed. in short i agree with the other guy who said take the tricky parts out just juggling the knives would be impressive enough. in short keep it simple and play to the audience. also non jugglers view drops as a sign of terrible dissaster versus a mistake thats made by the best so hard moves that get messed up can ruin the apeal of the whole show.
Yeah. I was doing an incredibly informal talent dealie awhile back. No routine or anything, just improv to music, really. Nothing hard, but I started with pseudorandom sequences of heights and inside/outside throws with 3 balls. At some point, I remembered what I was doing and broke into a basic cascade. That was what got the best response. A cascade. Way easier than what I had been doing just prior. Granted, it was a pretty tight cascade, and, as it was synched to the music, it was fairly low; but the improv was synched too, just not to every beat.
I shouldn't have started with the improv, but there I was, and had to work with it. If I hadn't, I probably wouldn't have seen that phenomenon in such relief. The usual progression is from easier to harder. Or maybe it had nothing to do with the patterns and was just because it was the first obvious transition between them. I can guess all day.
Anyway, this is just to confirm/emphasize the thing about general audiences reacting to trick difficulty in ways other than we might expect.
There's another explanation for the phenomenon you're describing, which is that the cascade formed an "applause point" at which the audience felt able to let loose all the applause they had been storing up during the earlier section.
Building tension and then releasing it causes applause; maybe the improv section was the build and the cascade was the release.
Little Paul - - Parent #
Yeah, this.
If someone is busily doing lots of complex stuff running one trick into the next on and on on stage... The audience is left waiting for a gap they can applaud in. So give them a gap!
Good point. I will have to bear this (and other things) in mind if I do any more performing.
Daniel Simu - - Parent #
I build upon everything that has already been said.
For most of the tricks you listed: It does not matter what you do, but how you do it.
Don't talk, it is a skill on itself and looks silly when done wrong. Better have music to cover up for you!
All the things I suggest are: Suggestions! I recommend you change a couple things, but the possible solutions are endless!
3b:
You end with reverse mills mess? That is not going to give you a big applause. End with something visual. High throw one up pirouette, catch while landing on your knees!
You do both right and left shower? Why? Is it because you are moving around in different directions on the stage while you do the showers, or just to show off? If its just to show off, cut the left shower and find a way to make the right shower more interesting (walking around, playing with your face, one up or a single high low shower)
One up 360 3x? why 3 times? The third time is not going to be as impressive as the first one..
My suggested new order:
Cascade! For a long time, and walk around a bit
Collumns & crossing
Cascade again shortly, move around
Under the leg, make it as big as possible, throw the last one under the leg too far so you have to chase it
Relax again, easy mills mess or reverse or whatever
spectacular backcrosses and your amazing finally
the 1 up 360! Open yourself up for applause!
If 3 in one hand is not stable (I assumed since you didn't list 5b) don't do it.
Same goes for all the other routines:
Start relaxed, do a variation, move around, big trick, relax again, impressive trick, even more impressive finish that gives a clear moment to applaud!
Little Paul - - Parent #
This. Reduce the complexity of the trucks, and add in some movement around the stage. Own the space, fill the space, pause in the cascade after the "big" tricks to give the audience space to react
Keep it simple, keep it short. Don't feel you have to use the whole length of your music. If it's a 6 minute track and you've only got 2 minutes of juggling, cut the music short instead of padding the routine.
Leave them wishing you'd done more, not wishing you'd done less.
Little Paul - - Parent #
Not too self, when posting from your phone, proof teas twice
Robotic juggle - - Parent #
he is right stage presence is huge regardless of what your doing (make that stage your !@%$#) its just the only way. you can be the best juggler ever but if you cant own the stage its useless to preform stick to teaching or construction idk.
In terms of the tricks you list this is excellent advice. Definitely drop all the things you wrote 'needs work' or 'maybe' against.
I'd like to offer some advice about the stuff that is not your juggling:
When I used to perform on stage I was always really nervous before my turn. My boss often praised my confidence but truth was I was always faking it! I developed a ritual where I would sit down alone out of the way before I was due on & did lots of slow deep breathing to calm myself down while running through the order of my routine in my head. Most of what I'd run through was how to move during the act. I wanted to look like I belonged on the stage, I always went out & greeted the audience as if I was welcoming a good friend into my home.
If you are going to move from one part of the stage to the other, don't walk, stride. Keep your head up & your back straight, use your arms. The stage is a long way away from a lot of the audience so all your movements, including (especially!) just putting one foot in front of the other, need to be big, clear & precise.
Don't shuffle while juggling either, if you can't walk with precise even steps (both rhythm & distance) without stumbling over your own feet or fumbling your props it is better to stop juggling, stride to your new position then resume juggling.
(On this point, does anyone have the necessary Google Fu to find the video of Anthony Gatto, Thomas Dietz & Toby Walker in a squash court, this was in the early days of the WJF & the video ended with Anthony in the middle juggling eight balls while Thomas & Toby juggled seven ball half showers either side, then they threw their balls down & shouted, "Sport my ass!" to the camera. There's a bit in it where they all juggle five clubs while walking in a figure of eight. Watch how Anthony moves compared to the other two.)
Also think about how you stand. When people are nervous they often stand with their feet close together, one foot slightly behind the other & with their weight on one leg (ready for flight) which is very unstable especially when juggling. If you are stationary at any point make sure your feet are firmly planted shoulder width apart with weight evenly distributed between both legs. This will give you a solid base to juggle from & make you look confident. Don't hop from foot to foot (if you find yourself doing this walk to another part of the stage). Also work on confidently getting into the standing position. You've just done a nice confident stride across the stage, you don't want to ruin it by looking down at your feet & doing a nervous little tap dance while you get yourself together. Think economy of movement. Put one foot down at the end of a stride, put the other down firmly in position so that you don't have to twist your feet about to get them closer together or further apart. & don't look down at your feet. You are a juggler. You should be coordinated enough to stand up straight!
Instead of practicing your juggling one night, use an hour or so to practice walking & standing, yes you will feel silly for doing it but it will be the most productive bit of practice you will ever do!
Watch Freddie Mercury or Shirley Bassey with the sound down & watch how they exude confidence through their body language (then watch again with the sound on for full effect).
...Forgot to mention the Matt Hall effect!
If people like you, your act will be amazing regardless what you do. Show respect to your audience & they will respect you back.
I remember recently I saw Penn & Teller on TV (Fool Us) did a trick where they took an audience member's pair of glasses which somehow got lost & later reappeared being worn by Teller after they smashed his head out of a comedy concrete block or something similar. What really made me smile was after the trick was done Penn handed the girl her glasses back & then handed her a disposable cleansing wipe from his breast pocket in case there was any dust on her lenses. He probably didn't need to do that, it didn't benefit the trick or the rest of the audience in any way (other than perhaps adding a bit of feel good factor for people like me). I love the level of thoughtfulness & respect for their audience that this showed. This is the sort of attention to detail that makes a great performer.
Little Paul - - Parent #
I *think* this link to archive org is the right video, but the download isn't particularly quick so I've only been able to watch the first 20 seconds or so.
https://web.archive.org/web/20060222132038/https://homepage.mac.com/anthonygatto/.Public/GDW-MPEG-1.mpg
It's certainly got the right people in it, and it's shot in a squash court.
If for some reason that link doesn't work, start at https://web.archive.org/web/*/https://homepage.mac.com/anthonygatto/.Public/GDW-MPEG-1.mpg and click on one of the circles
Little Paul - - Parent #
I'll let our glorious leader work out how to fix that second link ;)
Little Paul - - Parent #
My download finished, it's the right video.
I see what you mean about watching how Anthony moves compared to Thomas/Toby. Anthony strides confidently around the space where the others sort of amble. They've all got similar levels of control over the pattern but the easy practiced confidence of the one who has spent his life on stage shows clearly.
Also the "Dietz Shoulder" syndrome is more pronounced than I remember it being.
Yep, good find thank you.
& my apologies, you will now spend your life watching how jugglers walk on stage!
pumpkineater23 - - Parent #
I've very little experience with performing but I've always found 3b yo yo goes down well with non jugglers.
I agree with what others have said about making your routine simple, especially with a talent show as lots of judges on them don't understand juggling and are very harsh with drops, for some it's as bad as them not even considering your act too much if you've dropped a lot. So I'd recommend keeping it to trick you can do easily with no warm up.
One other thing to think about is that your tricks that you know this well will probably be boring to you, that gives you a great excuse to add some movement or actions to keep yourself entertained as well. If you find your routine boring it can be quite obvious when performing it.
Roflcopter - - Parent #
wow guys, thanks for all the feedback. I've read all the posts and I like what has been said. I'm really sick today so I wont be able to make a video but hopefully soon I can show you the whole thing on stage.
i was wondering, as i live in america, and have my whole life. how does the rest of the world look at us as a country? more out of curiousity as ive noticed that we seem to have a biggoted system when veiwing other countries
Rob van Heijst - - Parent #
No free healthcare. You primitives!
thegoheads - - Parent #
The millions of americans that get healthcare, then never pay their bills would beg to differ. My oldest brother must've had millions of (insert preferred unit of money here) in medical bills that he never paid. And he somehow kept getting treatment.
Daniel Simu - - Parent #
Yep, I look at the USA as a country. And as a continent. And as a place to envy because of all the online shopping you can do. And as a place to laugh at because of all the problems we don't have in NL.
Also, I am always confused when I ask someone and they answer 'thisandthisstate'... I always assume that all the states have the same culture anyway, so why not say you are from the USA?
When people ask where I am from I enjoy saying I am from Europe. Not as a joke, but because I have this (unpopular) opinion that we should grow even closer than we are already.
Am I American? I speak American English, absorb American media culture... What do you guys have that I don't?
I do like Gouda cheese and Dutch bread though...
Robotic juggle - - Parent #
as far as the states are concerned their is actually a large cultural gap. say split the country into three parts the northeast the southeast the west. the northeast has a large variaty of people ,ideas, and veiw points. as its were most immagrants went to right of the bat so you get a cultural blend of everything; making it the part of the country that worries about political correctness such as african-american versus black and native-american versus indian. the southeast is a totally diffrent story deep seaded racism is not uncommon due to the prolonged exposure to slavery and becouse of the violence that offen centered around other cultures in the south even today its primarily small white towns with some level of racism open or not (this does not include florida as it fits more to the western catigory) the west filled with people of all kinds is the largest area it was developed later and therfore doesnt have the northeastern relation to britian (meaning only the cities look diffrent) and while there is some racism due to the chinese and the irish immagrants taking a large majority of the pay in the days of the railroad; the cultural devide exposes kids more and more recently its been less biggoted than in years past. on top of all this each state has somthing it does or is known for like idaho potatoes or corn form iowa, theirs also crabs from main, surfers in california, the list goes on... i hope this gave some insight to the whole country then state thing.
Daniel Simu - - Parent #
Thanks for the clarification.
However, this makes your states sound like they are as different from each other as the provinces of the Netherlands, the Bundeslaender of Germany or the countries of the UK.
Robotic juggle - - Parent #
they really are we have accents for the diffrent region and slang is litarally a class you can take in colledge its called ebonics america has a rich history leading up to obamacare ("free" healthcare) a horribly dumb system that will probibly get repealed and the idea of free healthcare would die with it. is it that hard... i mean the canadians figured it out (meant as a joke i have nothing against canadians)
Daniel Simu - - Parent #
Yes, getting free healthcare is hard now. It would have been easier to solve 200 years ago but nobody then saw this coming.
The tagline for the USA was freedom. Nothing wrong with freedom, everyone thought, so they used this term for anything they could think of. Freedom to protect yourself (I have the freedom not to need to protect myself, but that is a whole different story), free market.
Free market? Freedom of one can reduce freedom of another. Free market is a parasitical virus that quickly reduced everyone's freedom except the 1%. But since freedom was 'good' free market was allowed to take over the medical industry, and thereby making it twice as expensive as in the rest of the world. This is a price no government would be able to afford for their citizens, and now it is hard to change it back.
Good intentions, bad results. I don't understand why Obama gets so much critique for his good intentions (and possibly bad results), but the founding fathers never get this kind of critique!
Robotic juggle - - Parent #
its more the exeption clauses that get me( cancer patients, people with cronic anything really) and it raised unemployment because companies had to pay more for each person on staff leading to heavy lay offs. and while i can conceave no way to fix these problems i would have just left well enough alone and focus on real problems like the horrid amounts of outsourcing that leave us at a high unemployment rate
Daniel Simu - - Parent #
I don't know enough about obamacare to comment on this.
Solving outsourcing seems like a silly thing to me. Aren't we all happy if someone else does our work?
In the end most of our jobs will be outsourced to technology. Better become an artist, it seems that this field will take longest before it can be outsourced to robots!
Consider watching this if you are interested in understanding how technology will replace all jobs.
https://youtu.be/0SuGRgdJA_c
And this docu doesn't even deal with the upcoming AI superintelligence explosion. ( https://wiki.lesswrong.com/wiki/Intelligence_explosion )
thegoheads - - Parent #
" I don't understand why Obama gets so much critique for his good intentions (and possibly bad results), "
Widespread ignorance and propaganda is my best guess.
That single sentence quoted above sounds more intelligent than anything I've ever heard a fellow american say about Obama. The general mentality around here is that Obama is our dictator and can do whatever he wants, whenever he wants, and is purposely destroying our country because he's a stupid poopey-face.
I know nothing of politics and have purposely never followed any of it. Still, Obama seems to be the first leader genuinely trying to make things better for Joe Average, which is not profitable for Joe Super-Rich, hence the propaganda.
Rob van Heijst - - Parent #
Apart from the accents I don't think there is any cultural difference between the provinces of NL. (If you mention carnaval I'll kill you!(in a figurative way))
Daniel Simu - - Parent #
Different industries, different education levels, different building styles, different histories, different political viewpoints, different landscapes, different religions, CARNAVAL!
You should spend more time traveling trough your own country ;). I biked around many many summers and this taught me a lot! Of course, since the automobile and the internet the differences are fading, but there are still enough people living where their families came from, carrying on their traditions and habits.
Daniel Simu - - Parent #
In Brazil!
And in the not so civilized part of the Netherlands where Rob lives ;)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carnival_in_the_Netherlands
Rob van Heijst - - Parent #
That's true but don't get me mixed up! I despise it!
Rob van Heijst - - Parent #
It's a holiday that's only celebrated in the two most south provinces (North-Brabant and Limburg) which is unfortunately where I live. There are special tents set up for it where people can go to dressed up in weird costumes. There seems to be an exception for the ages 12 to 18 who will go as sluts. People use it as an excuse to not do anything and get drunk. On top of that your brain will explode from the worst music possible that is blasted non-stop for 4 days out of those tents. E.g. https://youtu.be/Jz0w1EDhYic .
I always say that carnaval is just like a juggling convention only without the juggling, fun people and games and with tons and tons of wasted people.
Rob van Heijst - - Parent #
And the whole year through if you something as trivial as jogging pants (literal translation; I don't think it's called that way in English) you will get lots of mean comments on it but when it's carnaval it's suddenly OK to get dressed up as a condom...
Robotic juggle - - Parent #
Sounds like marte gras in new orleans.
Little Paul - - Parent #
I was half expecting that link to be gabber... But I guess Rotterdam is too far north for you ;)
Rob van Heijst - - Parent #
What do you mean? I don't get the reference probably because I'm from the south ;)
RegularJugular - - Parent #
According to wonkypedia
"Although a house variant from Detroit reached Amsterdam in the late 1980s, it was the producers and DJs from Rotterdam who evolved it into a harder house variant which is today known as "gabber"."
I know someone who seems to love gabber.
Also I thought that based on some Dutch radio station I heard the other week, music like the what you posted was the majority of the music played in Holland ;p (It sounded similar to me although mostly a bit more traditional)
Rob van Heijst - - Parent #
I'm glad it's not traditional Dutch music. I don't know if there's such a thing as traditional music here. Most of the music that people listen to is foreign. There are, however, some bands who seem to really nail Dutch music such as Doe Maar.
Typical music associated with is I'm afraid to say Schlager or 'het levenslied'.
I've often regretted sharing a language with you guys because that makes it way to easy to expert that music to Belgium.
I can forgive you though because of Doe Maar.
Roflcopter - - Parent #
I hate how when someone talks about the south, the first thing that comes up is racism. I'm just making a general statement here but why does everyone think we are down here hanging blacks from trees or making sure that they drink from a different fountain. There is a huge integration of white and black here in the southeast precisely because of slavery. We lost the civil war and the freed slaves didn't leave. With this there has actually been a decrease in racist behavior( to an extent). I'm not saying that there aren't a lot or racists down here because there are. Even blacks, some are into this Afro-centrism type deal. I dunno I'm just trying to make the point that "Racism" is not a valid point to pose southeastern culture on. I don't wanna make some big like political race deal on a juggling forum so I won't say anything else on it.
I'm a certified South Carolinian
I think one of the problems as an an outsider is only the extremeness of a country/culture is seen as newsworthy by the media, so we only see the extremities - westbro baptists, anti-abortionists murdering doctors, refusal to reach science that includes evolution theory, lynch mobs, people living in poverty, corrupt police and politics - and then we generalise and base our views on this narrow viewpoint.
Robotic juggle - - Parent #
@ roflcopter while yes lynchings no longer happen and we all poo in the same grubby stalls at wallmart racism is what shaped the culture thats why there are those black-centerized people. I wasnt saying thats the only diffrence but its a large one
Little Paul - - Parent #
If you want to know how we view the USA, do what we all do and watch your tv shows and films, listen to your music, and drink your rediculously sugary soft drinks.
We really have very little else to go on.
Unfortunately.
Little Paul - - Parent #
Oh, and Dear America - please stop GETTING BACON WRONG!
Robotic juggle - - Parent #
This gave me a hearty laugh thanks for that early morning pick me up
thegoheads - - Parent #
Okay, I'll bite. How does this america place get bacon wrong?
Little Paul - - Parent #
American Bacon: Thin cut, narrow, short strips of belly pork cooked until they're crunchy and inflexible. It's about 50% fat, and is inedible as a sandwich filling unless hidden amongst other ingredients.
British Bacon: "back bacon" - Thicker cut, wider slices of pork loin - still attached to a section of belly pork, with about 10-20% fat surrounding a large succulent piece of pigmeat. Cooked gently in a frying pan until the fat renders down leaving the rest flexible, succulent and juicy.
Ideal in a sandwich, bread slightly moist from bacon juices. Available in smoked, unsmoked and wet/dry cured versions either with the rind (skin) still attached or trimmed up. I favour dry cured, smoked, rindless.
British Bacon: "streaky bacon" is also available over here, but is much less popular. It's belly pork like american bacon, but with a milder cure and thicker slices. Even when we use that, we don't cook it to within an inch of it's life like you guys do.
"Canadian Ham" - like British bacon, but trimmed to within an inch of it's life with not a piece of fat in sight. In my (limited) experience, this is worse than american bacon as while it might *look* right it's dry and uninteresting.
Also - seriously america, WTF?
Little Paul - - Parent #
YesYesYes: https://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2012/3/7/1331136694122/Felicitys-perfect-bacon-s-007.jpg
NoNoNo: https://www.thedeliciouslife.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/bottega-louie-bacon-sandwich.jpg
thegoheads - - Parent #
"like you guys do."
I buy the good thick slices and cook them the "british" way. Apparently I wasn't doing it "wrong". I see the thin slices on the shelf and am aware that I could buy those and overcook them if I wanted to, but I don't. Just personal preference, I never even knew I was doing it the "british" or "correct" way. Sorry to disappoint your american stereotype :P
pumpkineater23 - - Parent #
Americans know how to put on a good spread when it comes to BBQs. Marinated steaks, salads, jacket potatoes corn on the cob.. etc. They really put some love into it. Of course some americans have been known to put no effort into their BBQ's at all, then get really drunk and burn all their horrible cheap meat to a cinder, just like the British do!
Robotic juggle - - Parent #
depends on were you buy your bacon i get mine from arthur ,an amish town, (for those who dont know amish is the name for a group of people gennerally christian who shun electricity and use horse and buggies) were the pig is fresh killed and the bacon is thick and juicy, just like you described over there. that is the best way to do bacon i concur.
noslowerdna - - Parent #
Are you referring to the Bacon Explosion?
Bacon Explosion
Heard of Louis Theroux? I think you're all like the people he talks to! :P
My most enduring impression of Americans was formed at BJC 2004 where we were joined by Jonathan Root, Bill Berry, the La Salle brothers, Jay Gilligan & Matt Hall who all worked their socks off for the whole festival, performing, running workshops, hosting shows, giving up their time in the big top to help & talk to others & more. All were powerhouses of enthusiasm & were amazing genuine people. You couldn't ask for finer ambassadors for your country.
Yes, your country has a lot of problems but guess what? So does mine. There are bigoted arseholes everywhere. Just make sure you are not one of them & don't tolerate their behaviour.
Oh & get yourself to a festival outside of the US sometime!
Robotic juggle - - Parent #
oh I want to sometime but Im as broke as a rope
To sum it up my thoughts in a sentence: A high tech country with a generally backward society.
RegularJugular - - Parent #
Years ago I heard from someone who'd lived in the USA and England and they said that one of the most obvious differences between the USA and England how much more "flag-waving" goes on in the USA. I believe he was talking about an excess of National Pride that sometimes seems to overwhelm US citizens, for example crying depending on whether their desired president gets elected or not.
My personal investment into US politics used to extend as far as hoping a Democrat would win, because George W Bush's speeches were awful compared to what the other party's scriptwriters managed to pull off. I really wanted Obama to win his first term in office, because I thought that when I saw US politics on the news, he would be significantly less annoying. Kerry also... What it has since taught me is how little difference there is between the two. One does have better scriptwriters than the other, no question.
However, most of the way I see the USA is through, like, y'know that telly box and it's morality plays. The US does the world a wonderful service with it's portrayal of itself as some all seeing, all caring World Police. The UK does the same. My attention span for cola adverts has improved though-out my life. I also loved Scrubs, although I could never get along with ER or House. That said I love how House tends to use narrow DoF from what I've seen, if only real life were like that.
Regarding American Healthcare:
https://youtu.be/qSjGouBmo0M
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/03/health-care-costs-_n_3998425.html
US citizens pay more than UK citizens (per capita) to get healthcare that they then have to pay for. Haha *Ironic Nelson style laugh* The jokes on us though, our government appears to think healthy fiscal policy looks like https://twitter.com/grantshapps/status/446363611972534272
I'm still looking for my point, although I largely agree with LP and Orin. However I find it really difficult not to be a "bigoted arsehole" I used to think if I could identify Racism in places that weren't me then I wasn't racist or bigoted. Identity has many layers and is strange stuff.
im going to post the next juggling question now. i would have last week but i was on spring break and not home. so trivia question two here we go. in relation to site swaps how high would a throw labeled D would be equal to juggling how many balls
thegoheads - - Parent #
I think you need to phrase the question better :P
And a "D" could be any height, depending on what you're doing. It could be thrown straight at the ground and left there for a while. As long as it's dealt with 13 beats later. And it's hard to say it should even be called a D. Here's some trivia for you: which "inventor" of siteswaps would rather call it a 13 than a D? There might even be more than one answer ;)
Daniel Simu - - Parent #
Ohh that is a more exciting question :)
Still easy though: Bruce!!!
Robotic juggle - - Parent #
The answer you gave was the one I was looking for in the beats sorry about the poor wording
Robotic juggle - - Parent #
ok again poor wording the 13 beats was the answer I was looking for. ugh
Little Paul - - Parent #
This!
Siteswap theory says nothing about throw height, it's all about throw order. Any assumptions about the height of the throw (as measured from the jugglers hands) eg "a 4 is straight up, about head height and returns to the same hand" only make sense when you also make assumptions about the style of throw, position of the hands, and how many hands are doing the juggling. Eg in 3 handed siteswap a 4 wouldn't land in the hand which threw it.
Boppo is the obvious answer to the "who prefers 13 to D" question, but I do wonder what some of the others think. I don't remember hearing from them on the matter.
Wasn't it Ben Beever who came up with the letters for high throws? Everyone else before that used numbers.
Roflcopter - #
Wishlist
List here the next props, items, or toys that you plan on owning next. 4 items (quantity of said items no counting i.e. 3 mouth sticks is counted as one item) in order of importance to you. I always like hearing others interests in props. I'll start:
1. 5 white delphins
2. 5 yellow(?) mmx plus
3. 24 or 29 inch unicycle
4. a mouthstick
Roflcopter - - Parent #
colour (like the British spelling?) or other small details are also nice.
thegoheads - - Parent #
poi
RegularJugular - - Parent #
I'd quite like
a Kendama
a yoyo that I can get along with (this item may not exist)
Some jumping stilts (pro-jumps, powerizers, etc) although I'm not really sure, considering how much I hurt myself using them last time and they take up much space.
More unicycles, although I think I'd prefer more space to put them first.
A decent training space.
I'm moving and will lose my 12m high (but very cold) garage.
decent cigar boxes
a decent stick for the trick at 2:22 in https://youtu.be/UZm94ou4FOM
I bet at least one person on the juggling edge can tell me what Jon Peat used.
I've used a wooden stick with a audioplug screwed into the end.
It works great but breaks easily if it drops on the wrong end.
Alternatively I've just used a ...machine tool to create an oval shape at the end of a wooden stick.
More friction but you can drop this a few times without breaking it.
Little Paul - - Parent #
I don't know what Jon is using (looks like it's possibly some variant of the carbon fibre tent/fishing pole approach?) but I used to use a 6ft garden cane with a pop rivet pushed into the end and held in place with a bit of tape.
I say "used to" because I've since swapped the pop rivet for the end off a cheap plastic spinning plate stick. It's a bit smoother so I find it's a little kinder on the ball. Although attacking the pop rivet with a piece of sandpaper would probably have done the same job!
If I'm travelling any distance to a fest and for some reason I'm not taking the car/van (so don't have space for the cane) I just take the tip with me and stop off at a local garden centre near the fest to buy a replacement cane.
Whatever you use, I've found it better for the pole to be slightly flexible rather than stiff as it takes some of the wobble out of the balance introduced by precession of the ball.
I've tried using tent poles from a tent I had lying around.
The cheaper versions aren't strong enough for me. I use regular footballs for ball spinning and they were too heavy.
Luckily the broken pole could still sort of hold the tent upright and my dog enjoys having her own little home.
I think what I'm using could be a garden cane as well. It seems like a fitting name for it.
Google image search only returns bamboo sticks which mine isn't. The size is similar though and I like that it is a little heavier as bamboo.
I've always considered buying spinning plates just to toy with them for a while but I couldn't imagine getting into plate spinning*. Maybe I'll buy them and use the stick as a better tip for my pole as soon as I tire of them.
* Isn't padiddling much cooler?
For the Bungay Trick (for that is the official name) I use a bamboo cane, available very cheaply from any garden centre. So does Monte who I first saw do the trick (at Bungay, naturally). I also use a pop-rivet (blind rivet). I make sure the cane is reasonably straight - there's always some bend in them, but I make sure when balancing it that the bend is in line with the centre of my body, so it doesn't really affect the balance. The rivet has to be a smooth one (some are a bit ragged) to avoid damaging the ball. Pros: this is all very cheap, Cons: it doesn't pack down neatly. My ball is particularly light compared to standard footballs.
I've also tried tent poles and extending fishing rods (too flexible for me) although I know others are happy with them (Rob Fiery, Ste3void for example). Depends where you'll be working on it I suppose: I used to keep a spare pole at our local workshop.
I'm still using my original stick which I have had since the last Taunton convention which I'm guessing was about 18 or 19 years ago.My pole has quite a big bend in it but as I look at the ball not the stick it doesn't seem to affect the balance.
I thought the trick was called the "Bungay entrance exam" after a throw away comment during one of my early Bungay performances.
I heard this week that I have been accepted to do a food stall at EJC Millstreet.I am very exited about this as I have wanted to do one since attending my first EJC in Grenoble 1999.When I have my menu's finalised I will give juggling edge a sneak preview.
Monte
Little Paul - - Parent #
I've pretty much fallen out of the "must buy new toys!" cycle, although I'm looking forward to seeing Dan The Hat's new manipulation caps at BJC. Although if I had to list some, the following have been on my shopping list for quite some time:
1 - A vent puppet. I keep myself amused on long car journeys by practising ventriloquism, but I don't have a suitable puppet yet.
2 - 30 years after I was first given a set, it's high time I splashed out on some good quality cups and balls. I want a nicely weighted set which are a joy to use, in the hope that then I'll enjoy playing with them. There's a lot of research needed before I spend any money though, as I'm looking to spend a fair amount.
3 - I might eventually buy some Albatross clubs (5 of, in a solid colour, probably either white or orange) but as I only juggle clubs twice a year (and when I do, there are always plenty of spares around to borrow) it doesn't seem worth the effort
4 - A nicely tailored suit jacket, with a topit installed.
None of the above are ever likely to be used for performance, although No 4 might well be used for a wedding.
A vent puppet.
That sounds fun! Ventriloquism is one of the many variety acts that has all but died out.
A few years ago we hired a local ventriloquist for one of our kids parties, a guy called Karl Jeffery (https://www.themagicalventriloquist.co.uk). His acts was fantastic, full of humour and slapstick.
You can find some really good performers doing the rounds at kids parties. One of my favourites is the (rather generically titled) Mr. Merlin (https://www.mrmerlin.co.uk/), I've booked him about three times so far! Another local favourite of mind is Captain Raggy Beard - who is primarily a storyteller, there are very few of them around these days.
Anyhow, you keep yourself amused on long car journeys. Are you the driver?! I can imagine you with a large bird on one arm, holding the steering wheel in its beak ;-)
Colin E.
Little Paul - - Parent #
I managed to lose most of the evening last night clicking around youtube watching videos of children's entertainers. It's been a long time since I last did a show for a kids birthday party so I've been a bit out of the loop - but the amount of respect I've got for a good kids entertainer is immense.
Birthday party magicians come in for a lot of stick from other magicians (and a lot of the poor quality ones deserve it!) but to do it well is a real skill that takes a fair bit of effort to perfect. It's not something I've had cause to look into since I quit performing myself and got a real job - so it was an evening well spent.
Anyway, long car journeys - yes it's me driving (and generally the only one in the car, or I wouldn't be talking to myself) - your suggestion of driving with the puppet reminds me. I used to keep a set of ping pong balls and a shell in the car. If I was stuck in a traffic jam, I would amuse myself by waiting until there was a car full of kids next to me, and then producing an endless stream of ping pong balls from my mouth.
Lots of fun to be had when they inevitably jump up and down until their parents turn to look at which point I would stop and go back to watching the road... until the parents turn away again.
I once did the food ay a story telling convention in St Donats in Wales. There were a large number of story tellers there, perhaps into 3 figures. It was a really nice event which had been going for years and is probably still happening now.
I have been playing with doing some vent stuff, but not really sure what I want to do with it. Just been doing some basic practicing, still having trouble with plosives, but otherwise getting the hang of it. There is a guy in town who would be a fantastic character, and another who, if caricatured, would make an excellent puppet.
Otherwise, I pretty much have what I want/will be allowed to get for the time being.
I will buy some replacement Henry's pirouettes at the BJC.
I might buy any unusual prop the grabs my interest as long as not many people do it.
I wish for a large and high space where I can run a circus (in particular it needs to have storage and I need to be able to hang aerial stuff in it) the minimum cost of this is something like £25k so I can't see it happening soon.
Nigel
I think I've just about managed to kick the new props habit. I love new toys as much as the next person but I've come to realise that I will always come back to balls & clubs, anything else is just going to be a fad with me. A couple of years ago I had a big sale of loads of kit that I got rid of to a new home where they would see a bit more attention. The ~£300 I made selling off unused props was very useful too.
That said I am very impatiently waiting for some new skates...
On my wish list is a couple of acres of land with a massive barn and a big top so I could hold another Kevention.
Cedric Lackpot - - Parent #
1. A bigger garage to keep my existing crap in.
2. A second hand juggling store to flog all my vast quantity of unloved and unused juggling kit in.
3. A bonfire for all the other crap.
4. A pair of matched Victor Tella 16-plait 8-foot bullwhips, for a mere $1,000.
Also, make your own mouthstick. Start with a wooden spoon from the kitchen and get whittling. Seriously, do it.
Daniel Simu - - Parent #
1 3 Silicon bouncing balls 76mm. White or yellow depending on how much the yellow looks like my current balls
2 Renegade spinning rings!
3 Mirages! They are so much cooler than my pirouettes! Too bad that I never juggle clubs anyway and if I do I borrow from other people, I never bring my own.
4 White sil-x light 78mm to replace my yellow ones in case of a performance
I need some other props which I'll more likely get before any of these listed above, but I probably need to build them myself...
thegoheads - #
Hi Jugglers!
Check out my new tutorial video for lots of 5 ball multiplex patterns
https://youtu.be/cOpAVoLO-e0
All feedback welcome :)
I also recently posted some beginner tutorials there
https://www.youtube.com/JugglingTricks
So if you know anyone that wants to learn to juggle 3 balls and some basic tricks, feel free to send 'em there :) I started working on that youtube page back in 2007 to give back to the community for all the knowledge I gained from youtube tutorials when I started juggling, and I plan to add plenty more beginner through advanced tutorials soon!
Happy Juggling!
-Steve
pumpkineater23 - - Parent #
Great going Steve. Your tutorials have always been top notch.
pumpkineater23 - - Parent #
Did you manage to get your 'comment reply' problem sorted out?
thegoheads - - Parent #
I think I need to use a different browser but I haven't bothered with it yet. The only internet computers I have access to are owned by people who specifically want to use outdated versions of internet explorer and won't let me install a different one.
So unfortunately I still can't comment or reply to comments but youtube messaging seems to be working so at least I can answer any questions.
pumpkineater23 - - Parent #
Loosely related, don't know if you have the annoying problem of youtube videos not playing HD automatically? I recently found out a good way to sort it out:
Tools > extensions > Get more extensions > Search the store
Type: auto HD for youtube
Then select Magic Actions For Youtube
Add
You then set it to always automatically play in 1080p, set the size, and other stuff!
Roflcopter - - Parent #
I liked this. I looked at it yesterday and can now do a stacked multiplex thing. Then it got me looking at your other stuff and now I'm working on BBB thanks!
noslowerdna - - Parent #
Very nice. I revisit your videos often, when looking for sparks of inspiration.
Peter Bone has gone viral.
https://msnvideo.msn.com/?channelfrom=en-us_msnhpvidmod#/video/96f04e7e-fbeb-4912-a5a7-3f31048f1577
David Cain
Mike Moore - - Parent #
Great to see, very well deserved. Congrats, Peter!
I think you mean "Congratulations, juggler." 'Cos that's how he's billed there. :/
Now all we need is a little smile - c'mon Peter, I know you are concentrating hard, but just a little smile! ;-)
Unfortunately, instead of an embed or link to Peter's video..it is an msn video uploaded by some "Jokeroo", without any mention of Peter. Does this in any way help Peter, his popularity or youtube channel?
Firstly, I'm not sure this is actually what I would call 'viral'. Secondly, this is completely with my permission. I was contacted through my YouTube channel by a guy from Rumble.com, part of which is Jokeroo I believe. He said I could earn more than through YouTube (ie nothing) by uploading my 3 ball stack video to Rumble.com and that they would be interested in using it. After verifying that it wasn't some kind of scam I did upload it to try it out and see what would happen. Basically you hand over the rights for them to use it however they want. They then distribute it to other sites like yahoo and msn to use and you earn 60% of the revenue from advertising. So far I've earned nothing, but maybe there's a delay. I'll keep you updated. The video on the Rumble website does mention my name but I guess the other sites don't have to. I don't mind either way.
If I do earn anything from this it will be the first time I've ever earned from juggling, which I am a bit conflicted about.
Click the info (i) button on the msn video and it does show the original Rumble text, which includes my name.
I'm pleased to hear you'll get some credit out of it, and perhaps some cash too. Good luck.
Roflcopter - - Parent #
Why does that make you feel conflicted?
Little Paul - - Parent #
Are you an Eliza bot?
Little Paul - - Parent #
Ahh. Please continue...
Just because juggling has always been a hobby for me. I'd worry that earning money from it would change the way I'd view it. It could become less enjoyable for me. I have been paid a couple of times in the form of juggling balls though.
Little Paul - - Parent #
If the payment worries you, donate it to charity. Then you're not being paid for your juggling, you're doing it for the greater good. Win!
I nominate my pension fund as an appropriate charity. I don't know if that counts as "the greater good", but every time I eat a doughnut I become greater.
thegoheads - - Parent #
Think of it as making money from the video, that happens to contain juggling.
Nobody really makes money juggling, they make money doing a performance that happens to contain juggling.
Daniel Simu - - Parent #
Ohh, nice phrasing!
Roflcopter - - Parent #
noooooiice!
I personally think juggling should be an Olympic sport! What do u guys think? Should juggling be in the Olympics yes or no? And please try and give some sort of explanation , I think is should be because gym jugglers are athletes! They train just as long and hard and put on just as good of a show, even contact juggling is a real sport I think should be included in the Olympics .
Roflcopter - - Parent #
I agree completely. Especially since it's a very global sport. It would increase appreciation for it all.
I do have to disagree with contact juggling though. Although I (as a novice contact juggler) understand that it is very difficult and requires practice, I don't think that the public would really receive it well. I can hear it now.. "he's just holding a ball and moving it around!" Although a really good juggler can portray that floaty illusion, we all know what is happening.
Roflcopter - - Parent #
You all have good points. I think a better thing to say is that it would make me happy if say that summer Olympics 2015 there would be technical juggling. It doesn't have to continue on but it would be extremely entertaining to see the "best" (whether you would agree or not) from each country go for old with the awe of mesmerized crowds. I think it would be nice for at least once. Perhaps though that would be something the WJF would do instead of the Olympics.
Little Paul - - Parent #
"contact juggling is a real sport I think should be included in the Olympics"
It's a girls sport
https://youtu.be/HiWOxcpxVvs
thegoheads - - Parent #
Wow! Awesome video, thanks for sharing.
I think peterbone's comment sums it up better than I could say it, as far as why juggling wouldn't work in the olympics. My personal problem with juggling in the olympics is if juggling became too mainstream I'm afraid it would lose some of it's magic for me. I'm sure there would be benefits too... I guess "hey, you should be in the olympics" sounds better than "hey, you should go on America's got talent!" haha.
Even when the WJF has offered decent prize money, it still doesn't draw in as many people as you would think. WJF10 will be December this year and first place will get $10,000! Plus they are doing a global regional video competition thing this year where people from all over the world can enter for a chance to win a trip here to Vegas to compete. Anyone who really likes to see juggling as a sport, WJF is the best we got. I'm hoping a lot of big names will show up this year, 10 grand would get my attention if I was good enough at the WJF tricks. Err, um.... I mean moves.
Rob van Heijst - - Parent #
Okay this is the second time I see someone calling tricks moves. I'm guessing that Jason has the fear that calling juggling tricks 'tricks' will make it sound less professional. Am I right?
Little Paul - - Parent #
The sports the WJF seek to emulate (gymnastics, diving, american wrestling) call the individual components "moves" so that's what the wtf calls them.
It's just a case of adopting an existing sorting terminology
Little Paul - - Parent #
iphone predictive spelling for the won
Rob van Heijst - - Parent #
In that perspective it makes sense.
I like the WTF lets keep that one in!
Little Paul - - Parent #
It's almost as if it someone should put it on a tshirt...
Cedric Lackpot - - Parent #
> It's a girls sport.Yep. That notorious girl Kati Yla-Hokkala, who has been a fundamental part of The Gandini Juggling Project since its inception, was the Finnish RG champion before she turned to juggling IIRC.Yay for girls!
Little Paul - - Parent #
Indeed, and had she been male she wouldn't have been allowed to compete. My intent was factual, not derogatory.
Ball/Hoop/Ribbon/Club/Rope events are female only floor events, just as Pommel Horse/Still Rings/Vault/Parallel Bars/High Bars are male only events.
Pierre Vdv - - Parent #
I do totally agree with you on both juggling and contact juggling. In my opinion the problem would come from the entry selection, since every country has to choose their champions. The difficulty would be to determine a global basic level and to decide how many participants each country can bring to the olympics.
Scoring could be similar to gymnastics or ice skating (as it's often said), with marks for both the tricks and the beauty of the whole routine. But then the hard part is to name and evaluate the difficulty of every trick on earth (I mean doing it officialy with the olympic commitee). Maybe it would take two separate categories, one for the "big classics" such as huge 7 club 5 up 360 etc. and another one just for creativity, where manipulation and just the creation of totally new patterns would be rewarded. (and I still think that part of juggling is a real sport).
But all in all it would be awesome to have such a beautiful stage for juggling!
Absolutely not. Firstly it's nowhere near popular enough. 99% of the general public wouldn't understand it. There are lots of other non Olympic sports that are a lot more popular, like karate, climbing and rugby. Secondly it would become far too competitive. It would become like gymnastics or trampolining where there are set moves and very little room for innovation - like the WJF but a lot worse. I think that juggling is just too broad an activity for inclusion. It would have to focus a lot more on one particular aspect and that would limit the number of competitors and public interest even more.
By the way, this subject has come up many times in the past on rec.juggling. This one for example.
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/rec.juggling/NGr4knIEMgE/f2DLO4oPcIgJ
Little Paul - - Parent #
Back in 2012, I spent a lot of the summer watching the gymnastics and the diving (for purely sporting reasons, there were no other reasons involved at all. Honest.) then once the Olympics were over I went back and re-watched some of the televised WJF competitions.
The WJF scoring made much more sense having spent all that time immersed in similar scoring methods. This escaped me completely the first time I watched the WJF.
Personally, I think that we're a long way off having the multinational structured competitions and globally recognised organisational body overseeing the sport and unifying competition rulesets etc which would be a prerequisite for it being recognised as an olympic sport - and even if we did it appears that once you get to that stage, you have to persuade the people running that organisational body to dissolve it and cede control to the IOC.
Which seems like more paperwork than any juggler I've ever met could be bothered with.
mike.armstrong - - Parent #
Was the WJF as erm, inspiring, as the diving and the gymnastics? ;o)
Little Paul - - Parent #
nowhere near it.
Although some of the haircuts were amusing.
Scott Seltzer - - Parent #
I came close to being that juggler. About 4.5 years ago I wrote a plan to get juggling into the 2020 Olympics. I did a lot of research and made many many notes on what it would realistically entail. My plan was basically to start with numbers and/or joggling since those are the easiest to judge (and wouldn't really go against Francis Brunn's purported quip: "I don't believe in juggling competitions. It's like seeing who could paint the fastest painting!" [1]), though I did consider eventually having some sort of freestyle event [2].
I shared my idea with only one other juggling activist and did get good response, but I chickened out before sending it to all the potential committee members I had considered.
-Scott
1. https://www.juggling.org/jw/86/1/brunn.html
2. See basically any discussion on juggling as art vs sport.
I think numbers juggling would be the only format that would make sense in the Olympics to a wide enough audience. The point of the Olympics is to answer the basic questions: Who can run the fastest? Who can jump the highest? Who can throw the farthest? For juggling the basic question is who can juggle the most objects?
Joggling while definitely requiring skill & athleticism will never be anything more than a novelty in the eyes of the general public.
I think those jugglers who think juggling can be a sport would like to see a competition based on rhythmic gymnastics & why not? The WJF have shown that juggling can fit that format. But then so could ballet or any other form of dancing. There are purely technical aspects to every performance art that could be measured as a sport. Should they all be Olympic sports too?
I'm not bothered whether juggling gets recognised as a sport or not. I practice my hobbies because I enjoy them, if everyone else on Earth thought that juggling was pointless, I'd still juggle. However, I'd hate to see it get to the point where 'armchair jugglers' came into existence.
I'd hate to see it get to the point where 'armchair jugglers' came into existence.
You are WAY too late on that one.
Little Paul - - Parent #
Been rocking that lifestyle for over a decade
Little Paul - - Parent #
As well as joggling[1] or numbers I think the one which stands a half decent chance (based on widely recognised rule sets and formal competition) is probably volleyclub
Although major league combat seems to be developing some coherent international rules, it's a bit like kabaddi. Although that made it onto uk tv, it's not an Olympic sport. I wish it was though, I used to enjoy watching it on telly. Very entertaining!
[1] I still can't take joggling seriously, no matter how much Albert Lucas wants me to.
Fully agree the first point.
"The ultimate jugglers' sport. The bid for olympic acceptance starts here. "
https://www.capsule39.com/tlmb_volleyClub.php
Brook Roberts - - Parent #
Whilst I play a lot more combat, I agree on volleyclub being better as a sport. I should really get round to playing more often...but having played on sand courts it always looks less exciting when someone has put a net up in a gym at a convention, but you can't throw yourself after wayward clubs.
Brook Roberts - - Parent #
Luke is making a push for Europe wide Combat via http://www.lukeburrage.com/combat/index.php
I think volley club would be great but I'm curious what rule sets these are? I've only played very informally but there are lots of things that seem to me like they could be taken advantage of, it's just unsportsmanlike so few people do...
I actually think MLC is easier to do a formal sport in the olympics as the rules are very clear cut (with the exception of 360 combat which I don't think works well)
If juggling would be allowed as an olympic sport so much other disciplines would have to be allowed as well.
The term olympic sport would lose all meaning.
Why would we even want to become an olympic discipline?
Paperwork? involvement of politics and nationalism?
Daniel Simu - - Parent #
I think plate spinning should be an olympic sport.
No, seriously another thing that should be a reason for juggling NOT to be an olympic sport: There are not enough good jugglers! I think very few jugglers can compare to athletes of other olympic disciplines, the level can raise a lot still! Of course many people train hard, but without any knowledge/research about training methods, no coaches etc... We jugglers still have so much to learn!
Among the few people who are at the top, many of them are not interested in 'sport' juggling...
pumpkineater23 - - Parent #
The five ring Olympic symbol would work rather well I think. Isn't there a flaming club Olympic symbol too?
Roflcopter - #
Bored.
My juggling has been feeling feeling slow and somewhat melancholic even. I'm really tired of juggling in my room all alone like some sort of weirdo. I long for the companionship of one of my kind. Also for the opportunities to show my town how good I have become. So I would like to ask for advice from you all about three things.
1) Creating a club; Any sort of tips on how it can be run, do do's not to do's equipment.
2)Performing; Namely street performing, stuff that you have encountered personally.
3) Five clubs; I'm really struggling with this.
Thank you,
Roflcopter
Little Paul - - Parent #
1) Find a venue, pick a time, advertise the hell out of it but most crucially *consistently turn up, on time, every week* - jugglers will find you, and a club with two members is twice as much fun as juggling on your own.
It's also important to remember that successful juggling clubs are as much about being sociable and having fun as they are juggling, so learn every new persons name and have some social time as well as the juggling session. A teabreak half way through, or a trip to the pub afterwards are both things which work well.
2) If there are local street performers near you, watch their show, tip their hat, and then hang around afterwards to talk to them about how you get started in your local area. If there are no local street performers near you, pick a spot in town where you're not going to block the street and build a show.
Performing is a skill, and just like any other skill you'll suck at first and get better with practice. Unlike most other skills, you can't practice it without an audience - so when you fail you fail publicly.
As an audience member, I much prefer "setup, build, big trick, pass the hat" structured shows (as they take the audience on a journey) than "I'm stood here juggling hoping someone will put money in my hat as they walk past" - the former is all about audience engagement, the latter is largely ignoring the audience.
Whichever style you go for - Just Do It. If you wait "until I've got trick X, then I'll be ready" - you'll never be ready. The best time to learn performance is now.
3) It's hard. Suck it up and keep practising. If you want more targeted advice, you'll need to be a bit clearer about what isn't working.
Roflcopter - - Parent #
Valuable information thanks Paul.
thegoheads - - Parent #
For 5 clubs, how good is your 4 clubs? I recommend getting really really solid with fountain on doubles and singles, 55550 crossing flashes (double spins of course) and 53 double-single on both sides. Practice this in addition to working on short 5 club attempts if you like. Even though I could juggle all those 4 club patterns, and run 5 clubs for over 100 catches sometimes, I never had a real breakthrough with 5 clubs until I went back and drilled the heck out of those 4 club exercises until I could do them comfortably, nearly effortless, keeping my arms low and getting those perfect handle catches without reaching to correct improper spin. Hope that helps. Also, drill 3 club doubles in 3 or 522 with different dwell times.
As far as street performing, I think I remember you being in the USA so be ready to have the police run you off a lot if you don't figure out permit situations and whatnot first. Depending on where you are exactly it might not matter, but I've been run off just practicing places, not even drawing a crowd or doing "stunts".
pumpkineater23 - - Parent #
"I've been run off just practicing places"
That's outrageous! What was their reply when you told them you were just practising?
thegoheads - - Parent #
I've learned not to argue with authority figures. I'm the one doing something out of the ordinary, so I just politely leave. I usually practice in public parks so until the day I get kicked out of one of those I'll struggle to be optimistic. I only got ran off by the police once, on the Vegas strip, just juggling balls a bit and hanging out, not blocking traffic, not drawing a crowd, not putting on a show, similar to what happened to Mr. Garfield if anyone remembers (I don't think the video is sitll online though.)
Most of the times, it's security guards, who will simply call the police if I argue with them. I went through this when I was into skateboarding too, which is a bit more understandable because it has a much higher potential to damage property and cause injuries. But of the thousands of times I've gone'a jugglin' it's a rare thing to be run off like that.
Roflcopter - - Parent #
I need to practice my four, it's solid enough but I wanted to skip over it as soon as I could. I don't know why but four clubs just feels to me like a pain ad drag to practice.
2) Read the Business of Shows by Steve Rawlings, because this article must be pointed out every single time someone mentions street performing.
Little Paul - - Parent #
Oh good lord this!
How could I forget that one!
They say practicing a little bit each day is better than a long session once or twice a week, well what about a long session everyday?is thä better or does practicing to much have a Negitive effect?
Roflcopter - - Parent #
I normally practice a lot everyday and I don't think anything negative has come from it.
But it doesn't always make progression faster. With things like numbers juggling it will still take a lot of time. Although with easier things you can learn multiple tricks in a single day.
You always reach plateaus in progression and with long practice I think you just hit said plateau sooner but also get over it a bit quicker.
That was a long reply but I hope I didn't confuse you.
HardAttack27 - - Parent #
I understood what u said perfectly,I really see more progress when I do 2 or 3 hours every day all week , but there does come a point where I do feel burned out and relize it's time take a break.
Long sessions everyday are definitely how you will improve fastest. Just make sure to mix up what you're doing rather than exhausting yourself trying the same trick or kind of trick for large amounts of time.
thegoheads - - Parent #
In general it's not good to practice the same thing over and over for too long. Mix it up so you have several things to work on each session. I personally find that my shoulders and arms get a bit sore and tired after 2 hours. Sometimes I will still feel like juggling beyond a couple hours in a day but I wonder if it's productive practice at that point. If you wanna juggle 4 hours a day, splitting it up into two 2-hour sessions is probably better.
If you juggle just for fun, like me, the best time to stop and rest is when you aren't having fun anymore :)
Roflcopter - - Parent #
Penguin catches being something not to practice for an extended period of time...
HardAttack27 - - Parent #
I defintly mix up, I'm learning the 5 ball cascade and the reversal and 4 ball Mills Mess at the same time, a bunch of diffrent 3 ball tricks aswell,
Roflcopter - - Parent #
4b reverse mills? wow. you should have a little less trouble with a 5b cascade if you have that kind of 4b control. atleast I reckon. I always seem to want to get to 5 and then I go back to 4 prop stuff. recently I'm trying the mills mess. any tips?
HardAttack27 - - Parent #
They say 4 ball Mills Mess is more difficult than the 5 ball cascade, I dissagree, I tried doing five for a few months and made no progress, so I went back to 4, learned the fountain and reverse fountain.mixed fountains coloums, still working on the shower and the 4 ball wind mill, the cross armed reverse fountain will help with Mills Mess , and the cross armed 3 ball reverse cascade really helped,as far as tips, practice a lot!i mean it ALOT! Untill u have nightmares about practicing !and watch as many video tutorials with slow motion as u can, u never when somebody may say something that clicks in your head,
pumpkineater23 - - Parent #
I think long practice sessions might be more beneficial when you're young. Also how tired you are - I find it too difficult and not very beneficial these days to practice more than half an hour after work. Early morning practice is not a good idea as I'm like a zombie first thing in the morning (I have to leave out my clothes the night before in a human shape or I find myself trying to force socks or underpants over my head). Juggling is so much better when you don't work, you can just keep doing little bits here and there throughout the day.
Roflcopter - - Parent #
"when you're young"
yes, when I first started at 16 it was like nicotine addiction. somewhere in the world someone woke up and lit up a cigarette, I woke up and grabbed the yellow and red beanbags. even last night I didn't sleep much because I was experimenting with new tricks (namely body throws) and I feel energized still.
ah, youth.
Mike Moore - - Parent #
I have a two sets of patterns that I practise depending on my energy level. Box variations and body throws when I'm feeling energetic, blind, 5b, 7b when I'm feeling fatigued.